What school to send a moderately achieving elite player to?

So I said I would start my own thread. Not the greatest way to start out on here, likely, but it's important enough to swallow my pride and take anything that might get said I hope maturer heads will realize that these questions, while maybe harsh, are meant respectfully.

This is something that we are trying to weigh out. I say "moderately achieving" because let's face it, high 70s and low 80s are not necessarily going to win our kid an academic scholarship and he may not be well suited to pursue a career as a doctor or whatever, but at the same time, he's not an underachiever either and so therefore should be in a high school program that has a track record that speaks to its program's ability to prepare students for true success in university. In other words, we don't want to limit him to just playing ball and squeaking by for a degree, he should be able to actually do something beyond university that will allow him to obtain the life we have not been able to give him so far.

So you've got this kid that can play elite ball with the rest of them, but could also do something academically, and you see dominant basketball schools like Eastern, Pickering, Henry Carr, etc etc where statistically the scores coming out of the tests are lower than the provincial average and where the dropout rate is higher than other schools. That says to me: Hmm, not the best for academics. And it's not limited to city schools. I saw a recent "top 16" list where someone had listed St Thomas Aquinas in Oakville. From what I hear it isn't exactly known for it's academic excellence, either.

So what do you do as a parent? Do you send your kid to that dominant ball but not so great academic school with dreams of OFSAA AAAA titles and D1 scholarship offers, and maybe have them on a team so stacked that him and 8 or 9 other guys are all gunning for the same attention from the schools the coaches have connections to? Or do you go to a school that maybe isn't in the "Top 16" but does respectably in its division/region and has a high success ratio in terms of what it's graduates achieve in university? Do those types of schools also attract D1 attention? Say by way of example a Loyola Oakville or a Xavier Mississauga etc, that type of thing.

Please don't mistake my question as bashing any school or program. I'm looking for real advice, maybe even some stats on who's graduated from where, received scholarships and from where, and what they've been able to accomplish coming out of all that.

In other words, where would YOU send an A student / elite baller, if you could pick any school?

well, here is a novel concept..how about your son goes to the school he is suposed to attend. you know the one you pay taxes for that is right around the corner.

Even within our current 'local' area, students can attend whichever school they want, subject to enrollment availability. If we feel like moving to an area because it would be best for our kid's future, we won't hesitate and it is our right. We're not talking about transferring, we're talking about picking the right school and area for the long haul / entire high school experience.

You might want to do a bit of reading on how our tax dollars fund schools, also.

Ballerzmom! You asked for opinions and you may get some you may not like!

Maybe question the statistics!! What is the population of those schools - some of those stats do not factor in the volume of new immigrants, or if language is a barrier for those new kids who are part of a grade being tested!

Are you looking for schools that have a high rate of scholarships awarded? Those aren't just based on school stats - who you know, who coaches know, who happened to be in the right place at the right time!

Send your child to school in your area - support him academically and if he/she needs support...Kumon..and/or other such facilities! It seems more than academics if you are willing to move your entire family!

If you or your family live in a questionable area due to safety issues I understand but it sounds like this is more about the ball team than academic sucess!

Here is my answer.

No matter where you send your child it is up to him/her wether he/she wants to excel or not. He/she must set goals based on the cards he/she was dealt, and work towards them. If he/she was sent to the worst school, based on rankings, that doesnt mean he/she is doomed to be in those stats. He/she has to do their work and avoid distractions and negative influences. Obviously, some schools have more distractions than others as well as more negative influences based on it locations. But if your child wants to suceed then they will.

For basketball obviously I would check first the status of your local High Schools team. See if they indeed do have a team and they have a reliable coach. Sometimes teams struggle to find even a teacher supervisor to field a team. If your schools does well in its division then leave them there.

I played with Jordan Henry for two seasons ( actually one he broke his hand in my 5th year). Going into Gr.9 he was aproached by John Smith who was at Oakwood that year and probably could have gone to some of the better basketball schools in the GTA and got some minutes. He was scoring 15- 20 and starting on our team ( Mount Carmel Senior) in Gr.9. Plenty of Division 1 schools were interested until they heard of his Academic situation. He wasnt taking University courses so they stopped calling Coach. MC isnt the greatest Academic school but they are not near the bottom. My point is that he went to his local High School still got interest from Division 1 schools. If it was not for his bad selection of courses ( I remeber Coach Tucci advising him what to take and he didnt take it) he would be at a D1 school right now instead of a JUCO.

In the end of your child wants to suceed they will do what it takes to become succesful.

I maybe be assuming a lot here, but if your child was good enough now then the schools that recruit (EC, FHC, PICKERING etc)would have already snatched him up. So with that in mind keep him close to his friends and home, there is no point having him commute all over the gta for some pipe dream.

Bruins - I thank you for your input, but yes you are making alot of assumptions. Parents aren't going to necessarily let their kid be 'snatched' away by the teams you mentioned without some serious thought, don't you think?

ball4life - It's not more about either, academic success or ball, it's both. Actually, I'm lying, it's a bit more about academic success but trying to balance that against not being on a team that has not traditionally attracted interest from good schools looking for good ball players.

In a perfect world, we'd like a combination of the most scholarships awarded and the highest success rate of those scholars once in university - as I mentioned, the schools that best prepared their student-athletes for the rigors of university. How do some of the top ball schools stack up there? I'm not being sarcastic, we just don't know so we're asking. Getting the scholarship is only half the battle.

Stevelogan - great post, thank you for your insight. When you say 'if they do well in their division' I hear also 'not necessarily one that made the "Top 16" ' . Is that what you're trying to say? Thanks.

I'd just like to add that we are already strongly leaning towards staying right where we are, with a good school in our very own neighborhood that has a respected coaching system and a decent team (not ranked Top 16 here however) and it also prides itself on high academic standards. It's also in a fairly safe (read: sleepy haha) community. We aren't all that keen on moving into an area with some of the distractions as you put it Stevelogan just for some basketball pipe dreams as you put it Bruins.

There's just this nagging doubt - and maybe it's all about perception and the limited number of posts and info on boards and from verbal discussions with various sources and whatnot - that maybe it won't be good enough from a ball perspective - even level of competition wise, because higher level of competition helps the player improve and flourish, right? This is a ball forum, right, so it's a natural question...I'm sure there are other parents who have questioned this also. As I understand it Jamal Magloire was in Mississauga at first and then his mother decided living downtown was worth it so he could go to EC. Or something like that. So there are parents that consider these things.

Sorry if I've rambled on a bit here.

ballerzmom,
Silverthorn Collegiate Institute!

good basketball program with nike sponsor and good young talent
great coach
good academics
located in safe rural area (Markland Woods)

call and inquire with guidance you will be impressed

um.. i went to silverthorn tour with my school and i didn't feel really safe and we played the junior team and only lost by 4 points.. and i have no idea about the academics.

ballerzmom, these are my opinions:

I think that if your son/daughter has the talent then it will shine for sure wether it's a ball school or not. No matter what teams, scouts, coaches will eventually catch up to him/her.
I believe that a person can be successful in any school. It depends on who he/she hangs out with and if he/she is truly dedicated. Teens gets carried away by sports and might not focus on academics. As a parent, it's your job to keep your son/daughter on the right path.

I go to George Harvey. I am an athlete and an A grade student. I play more than 4 sports every year at school. It does take a bit out of my academic success but I do try to maintain the high 80s. And guess what? I dont attend the top basketball school or the top academic school.

As a student, I understand that I have to keep my doors open. More than half the students, I bet, dont think about their future. I love to play sports but I also know that my career might not be a NBA, NHL, Soccer player. Therefore, I have selected the right courses and maintained a grade that will take me to University and get me a good scholarship.

I think your son/daughter will do fine at their school if they have a strong soul and fully understands all the concepts of being a professional athlete. Tell him/her to practice and keep the grades up.

If he/she is good in ball then scouts will follow him and if that doesnt happen, he can select his path to an University. And one he goes to an University, he can agian try to pursue his dream.

That's just a bit of my opinion.

"I think your son/daughter will do fine at their school if they have a strong soul and fully understands all the concepts of being a professional athlete. Tell him/her to practice and keep the grades up." TAJ
ballerzmom
This is a person you should listen to. Imagine that he/she is a highschool student/athlete.
Listen to what your teenager has to say and guide and support them on their decisions. They will do well in the long run.

Taj - thank you so much for your input! Beecher is right, it's good to hear what a current student-athlete has to say about their school. You are in a "top 16" school for ball however aren't you? So you're lucky! I enjoyed reading your comments as you sound fairly similar to our kid. I guess we're just worried about that 'if it doesn't happen' factor ie he (we! haha) really want/need that scholarship. So trying to eliminate as many 'if that doesn't happens' as possible. Sounds like you have a good head on your shoulders however. With those grades and athletics you must have an offer or two already, no?

I have another question for you, though. Do you live in George Harvey area? I actually work at another school very near to GH. Alot goes down there, if you know what I mean. How do you feel about that?

Ballerzmom,

Well, I am in grade 11 so I styll have another year. I do plan to attend University and play sports. On the same hand, I do want my degree. I am not the best player nor the worst player so I don't expect University to come to me, however, I know I have the marks to grab them and try my sports luck there.

I don't live near George Harvey. It takes me about 25 min to come to school by bus. I came here because of its program and also for its senior soccer program. I have settled in very well and I am one of the leaders in that school. Personally, I wouldn't live in that area because it's boring. LOL.

It's pretty safe. The school is safe itself and we don't see many problems. Harvey had a bad rep back in the days and people styll feel, Harvey is a crazy place. But actually, it is not. We don't have many students like York Memo so the halls are easier to travel through. LOL

Anyways, our school is in the honourable mentions and made it to top 16 few times.

If your son really loves basketball and scholarship is important for post secondary education then take my advice. It might sound weird but yes,I will tell you the truth.

Send your son/daughter to Martingrove/Richview. They have good basketball program and the schools are rich. Scholarship will be more and it will help him/her money wise.
LOL, I am not putting down my school but I am speaking from a parents perspective. The richer th school the higher the scholarship (i think). So, ya.

I think Martingrove will suit him/her very well and the area should be a safe place to live/be.

If my Principal reads this, he will freak out! Instead of recruiting, I am sending a good player to a rival school. LOL

I want to let "Ballerzmom" know that I respect you for coming on here the way you have. You are doing what I feel that every parent should do and that is look out for her child. You seem to be confused as to what is the best thing to do so you decided to "Swallow your pride" and ask questions. I commend you for that because far too many times people feel that they know what is best without really looking into things. That is the biggest mistake anybody could make. The saying goes "There are no stupid questions" and it holds true for everything in life.
I see a mom who wants there to be options for her child, especially in education. It is the best way to look at things and now is the time to start making the right choice.
One point I want to make because I feel that "Basketball schools" such as Eastern, Henry Carr and Pickering" as quoted by you, are deemed academically inferior due to low test scores or whatever is used but this is not the whole story. The bottom line is the kid himself and what he does in school. It is essential that you as a parent, guide your child to put academics first, basketball second. Your child, if mentally disciplined will follow your lead and success will follow. Schools that you mentioned are schools that offer many courses that will definately get them into any university if the marks are there.
All you have to do is look at two kids that came from schools with huge basketball traditions and received Ivy league schloarships. Andre Wilkins attended Emery, which is not exactly known for it's reputation for academics, received a full ride to Cornell university and just completed his Junior season. Alex Hill just completed his freshman season at the same Ivy league university as Andre(Cornell). Here is something that you may not know, Alex Hill went to Eastern Commerce. The Ivy league by far has the toughest institutions to get accepted to based solely on academics. Their standards are extremely high. There are no high 70, low 80 kids getting a ride to Cornell. These two young men are playing at a school that is not a high profile basketball university, yet know full well that this was their best choice for a future. The fact that Cornell actually made the NCAA tournament this season is an accomplishment that is just icing on the cake for these kids. Let's be honest, Andre and Alex have won many tournaments, awards, league championships etc as basketball players but nothing associated with basketball will come close to meaning as much to these fine young men as when they graduate from Cornell university with a degree.
Instead of having your son look up to an NBA player, have him look up to these two young men. Trust me, you can't go wrong. Both of these kids played tournaments almost every weekend during basketball season and had a ton of club ball committments before ,during and after. The thing is they found a way to make sure that their priorities were in order and academics never suffered. Again, I use these two because it shows your son that there are no limits and anthing is possible.
I hope that I was of some help to you. Keep doing what you obviously seem to do very well, that is being a great mom.

Martingrove is a great school with a very safe area so i agree.

May i ask what's your home school. Martingrove, Richview, Michael Power are all great schools around that area, but in the end if you think about it, it all depends on focusing on your school work rather than your friends when you go to these "bad" schools that have some of the top basketball programs. All your kid has to do is FOCUS on his goals which should be getting good grades and being the best that he can on the court. Ofcourse, both of you have to make sacrifices, you have to guide him as a parent and he has to see that what your doing is only for his best. Sometimes he has to give up going out with friends, parties, TV, and many other distractions and believe me when that happens the success rate increases dramatically.

good job wcbasketball. good points!

Taj your parents must be very proud of you. Sounds to me like you are going to be a fine young gentleman coming out of your school. You have a better understanding of what goes on "inside" Harvey, I only drive past it every day and sometimes at night and see/hear stuff from the street, so I'm hardly an authority. This is not the first time someone has mentioned Martingrove and Richview, however. Thank you again for your thoughts.

And wcbbasketball thank you also very much. You are right, we are just trying to get a good start to high school and not have to go through the horrors of moving/transferring schools and all the issues surrounding OFSAA transfer rules etc. Your advice is well taken and I appreciate the time you took to write that out. I also value the insight into the marks and what it takes for good universities. We know this and we are trying to get him to apply himself better as he gets his current marks too easily I think. If he applied himself better, he could be an honors student. So that's why my concern with a school with high academic standards, because he seems to need that 'bar' so to speak to push himself. I know, he needs to be more motivated on his own, we're working on that!

Honestly I think you are right it would be better if more parents came on boards like these and traded notes and feedback. I take a look at some of the other sections and there's a bit of foolishness but I guess that's to be expected in any online forum. Information exchange can only lead to better decisions and opportunities for our kids so it's my hope that maybe some other parent will also read these types of information and benefit too.

For the record, we live sortof in between Loyola and Holy Trinity territory in Oakville. Contrary to popular belief about people who live in Oakville, however, we're not even remotely rich nor do we live in a big fancy house, far from it. As I mentioned, although I'm not a teacher I work at a school near George Harvey and oddly enough drive past Martingrove every morning at 7am and past it again at night. My ex also lives closer to Eastern and my son spends alot of time at his grandmother's who lives in Xavier territory. To top that all off an aunt he is very close to with a spare bedroom right in Notre Dame Ajax territory. So we have a few options that don't involve being sneaky or cheating the system. I guess in that respect we're very lucky. I hear all the advice and I can't help but think that keeping him close to home and having him attend a school like Loyola or Holy Trinity that has a good reputation for it's academics and coaching system and does respectably in ball (or so I'm told?? thoughts??) is probably not a bad idea after all. Although sending him to a school in the city where he knows noone will likely keep him more out of trouble!

there is nothing wrong with either HT or loyola both school have great basketball programs and good academics

There is some sort of trouble in every High School. Your child now has the responisbility to recognise where the trouble might be and do his best to avoid it. All you can do is advise and teach him how to stay away, as you are not with him during the school day.

[quote="stevelogan92"]There is some sort of trouble in every High School. Your child now has the responisbility to recognise where the trouble might be and do his best to avoid it. All you can do is advise and teach him how to stay away, as you are not with him during the school day.[/quote]

Truer words have never been spoken. (or written as the case may be)

I think my opinion of George Harvey and it's basketball program has been made clear in the AA ofsaa thread. I would avoid them like the plague!

To further educate yourself, find out all you know about the coach and his reputation. As much as the students attending the school and those on the team are to be considered, it is the coach that will be the biggest influence on your son.

Rec,

This is not a blog where you put down schools. Give a good advice or dont even talk. Read all the stuff that was said before and most people had something productive to say.

You are the type of people who makes life a difficult place for people. AND I WOULD ADVISE Ballerzmom's SON to STAY AWAY FROM YOU or YOUR TYPE!

For what I know, you have no idea about Harvey. And I am sure you don't know what happened at OFSAA. And for fact, neither do I. However, I know the players and the coach and I am sure that the story has been bombarded with exagerated opinions! In addition, you have no right to talk about the coach, students or the school itself.

I am a student there and I am an athlete. I believe I know more than you do about my school. We have competitive program for students. We have great teachers. You hardly see violence at our school. Students are friendly and we try our best to maintain a good environment. Yes, once in a while there are problems, just like in every other schools.

The coach has a good reputation. He is very well respected. He is successful and that's why he is employed and has a life (unlile people here who has nothing better to do other than put down schools and players! YES, I am talking about YOU!).

You want to see some class students, then come to Harvey. Actually NO! We would be better off without you!

PLAGUE STARTS FROM PEOPLE LIKE YOU!


Ballerzmom,

SORRY BALLERZMOM! This is your post and I dont want to start any argument. But when a person will attack my school and talk nonsense, I WILL DO ALL I CAN TO DEFEND.
I have given you my HONEST answers and gave my BEST advice. I am sure that you will have more trust on my words than of any other haters out here.

yeah george harvey is a really great school...... HAHAHAHA

GOOD JOKE BUDDY!!!

look what they did at ofsaa and that includes their PRINCIPAL...

why lie to a mother trying to find the best for their child

i agree with whoever said martingrove is a good school because it is. Great academics and they have good success in basketball.